A hearse on the way home
Knud Romer, who worked in The Idiots, Lars von Trier, in 1998, chatted with the director in early April, when he had just completed his new film, Antichrist.
"You look like a cure," Lars von Trier tells me when we greet before the Filmbyen screening room, where I will see his latest work, ANTICHRIST. The film has remained in the utmost secrecy and there are many security measures that I have the impression of going to a movie in the safe National Bank. "I come to save your immortal soul," he replied, laughing.
Ninety minutes after I get out of the chair deeply moved. On the way home, the fear and paranoia take hold of me when a hearse passes me on the road.
The idea of \u200b\u200bLars von Trier interview always makes me nervous. He is a master of irony and sarcasm, is able to change direction the conversation at any time and play the weakest points of the interviewer. We stayed in Filmbyen, but it says that Lars von Trier will be delayed. In the office door, written in imitation red blood dripping, the phrase: "Chaos reigns." An hour later they tell me that you want to do the interview at his home, about 20 miles north. By then, I'm so nervous I get out I'm afraid of the road.
But Lars von Trier is kindness personified. His wife Bente and waffles prepared herbal tea, two very comforting. I announced that we will do the interview below, in the basement. Lars von Trier takes only black socks, black pants and a black wide. I do not know how you will react, especially since I have the intention to ask why, like many great filmmakers, returns to make the same movie over and over again with ever more radical changes. The paranoia overtakes me, I am convinced that something terrible will happen.
But the man's basement is not the Antichrist, but the filmmaker at his most sympathetic and open, a man capable of living life with a profound awareness of death, which allowed him to create visually rich apocalyptic Antichrist makes a masterpiece. An hour and a half later, I regret not being a better interviewer. Upon leaving, I kiss you to thank. Once in the car, forget my nervousness, my fears, my paranoia. Indeed, and I swear it's true, advancement to a hearse on the way home.
- Lars von Trier : I have to hear your first question. Remember to be long.
- Knud Romer: You rolled conceptual films where you "obstructed" yourself. But now back Lars von Trier, the creator of images. Why?
- LVT : For me all are images, even if the chalk lines on the floor. But ... (hesitates) I felt depressed, I fell into a bottomless pit, and doubted he could return to make a movie. I returned to the material of my youth, when I was really into Strindberg, especially in Strindberg as a person. He was a amazing. So I tried to make a movie, I'm not sure how to express it, had not mentioned this before, a film that could throw reason overboard.
- KR "Chaos reigns."
- LVT: Yeah (laughs) I shot a series of images which then tried to join. I also found interesting to shoot a movie with only two characters.
- KR : Scenes from a Marriage.
- LVT: Scenes from a Marriage, but otherwise. I liked Scenes from a Marriage at the time, it seemed enormous.
- KR: But this marriage is that Bergman Strindberg.
- LVT: Yes, in Strindberg are more likely to push down the stairs.
- KR: Your view of women in the film reminds Strindberg more than Bergman.
- LVT: Yes, and I guess again asking about my view of women. I always had a romantic idea of \u200b\u200bthe battles between the sexes described by Strindberg. It speaks of the relationship between the two sexes, but do not know if there is a clear truth. Movies
gender
- KR : Now you film "genre." Tells the same story, your story, with different variations, from different angles, like many other authors have done before. What is your relationship with gender? Breaking the Waves is a melodrama, Dancer in the Dark, a musical Antichrist is a suspense thriller or a horror movie. Would you describe your relationship with gender as a romantic or playful?
- LVT : The genera are an inspiration. The story is much the same every time, now I realize that. Regarding gender, I do not think I ever really a gird. I think they should add something for everyone.
- KR: It appears that you stick your hand in a toy chest, you take something conventional and give back.
- LVT : Well, I studied cinematography at university, do not forget, and I liked enough genre films. Especially the black film, The Asphalt Jungle.
- KR: A lazy person who sees something you enjoy movies with all the existing genres.
- LVT: Yes, and everyone in the same film. (Laughs) But I'm not loyal to any genre. I like things do not fit at all.
- KR: Some say that you come with growing desire to transgress the taboo genre of all pornography.
- LVT : Well, flirts with the genre in The Idiots. Somehow, sexuality and horror are closely related. But porn? I do not know. Is this pornography? Maybe. But pornography has always bothered me. Porn movies are "utilitarian" and are often very crude. Excitation
rampant
- KR : Horror films and porno put the viewer in a state of excitement. To the horror genre, is fear. For porn, is desire. But both genres have in common unbridled excitement, and it is difficult to know where it ends the suffering passive and active desire begins.
- LVT : Okay, could not have said it better.
- KR: The desire is experienced positively, while fear of the negative. Your films have the same effect on the viewer. Is it something you're consciously or is it an emotional and personal expression?
- LVT : You make very difficult questions. Of course, it is interesting to consider. Try my films affect the public's emotions, but it created the image more expressive to me. So I say, even a little lie, I do not think the audience when I make movies. Above all, I am pleased myself with the images that ring. However, I will not deny that the intention of having some effect.
- KR : This film caused me terror, a terror that I can not let go. I pursued. If you first have to create images like that in my mind and then face their emotional expressions, I think it would have a nervous breakdown.
- LVT : The film is a pale image of reality. If you cry in a movie theater, is a pale imitation of a similar emotion you had in real life. In this sense, the film is half a second because it always draws on emotions to borrow a real life. If someone is afraid of seeing a movie, it's because you have a terror that can take and use to see her. But the film brings other things besides arouse emotions. For example, "The Scream" by Edvard Munch. My son just made a copy of this picture.
- KR: Your films are "shouting"?
- LVT : Antichrist is the closest to a scream. It came at a time in my life when I felt awful. The inspiration is found in one fears, emotions. Born there, but they become something else. There is no link "between the filmmaker and the viewer so that it can give you the key that opens the door to my emotional state. It does not work that way. The reason I'm interested in horror films, and I'm not sure that this film belongs to this genre is because I to do things very different. Passive Paranoia
- KR : Honestly, it's a relief for me to see you're back to a romantic universe hundred percent Catholic and symbolic reminiscences, well, everything. Most say it is pre-Romantic, Gothic in many ways, the style of Count Dracula.
- LVT: Yes, indeed. I can not analyze it, but visually we are in the romantic genre.
- KR : Before you say that a film does not reflect life. But a horror film is a passive experience and paranoid Indeed, a megalomaniac in which everything revolves around you, and requires a passive spectator. It's like the fear of the dark: a passive state and are paranoid and over again in your theater, where the protagonist is paralyzed, doomed to live in a bed, buried alive.
- LVT: Yes, do not forget to read Edgar Allan Poe. It was also a very romantic figure.
- KR: I think it's wonderful that your films express the fear of the dark when they are made to be seen in a dark room where the viewer is totally vulnerable.
- LVT : Once thought of making a play. It occurred to me that you can spend much more fear in a theater in a movie theater. Studied the possibility of doing a theatrical version of The Exorcist. I have always felt uncomfortable in a movie, but I feel even worse in a theater because it's live. Go see a play I am horrified.
And speaking of the public, it seems that only an infinitesimal part communicates. But I am very happy with this film and the images it contains. Arose from a real inspiration to me. As for me, a project has been honored. I think I was the same in The Idiots and other films of mine.
- KR: It seems to work a lot with the "scene primary. " The child who discovers and does not understand the sexuality of their parents, the great mystery. The child does not understand what happens, but feel you are transported by desire and fear. Playing the Freud, I would say this is the mother of all primal scenes, the fear that destroys all fears.
- LVT: I hear you ...
- KR: Okay, it's a good question. In a way, the film is therapeutic. However, the psychologist in the movie does not seem very professional. Am I wrong in thinking that it is almost a sadist?
- LVT: I have a little experience with cognitive psychology, which tends to cure the fear to fall into a ravine pulling the patient through the gorge, and goodbye fear. Apparently, it is a very successful therapy. Of course much depends on the height of the cliff. Actually have success with small slopes.
you know I like to get to people and make jokes. My male characters are usually idiots who do not understand a shit. In ANTICHRIST too. Of course, everything is fucked.
As if the fear is one thing and reality another, well, questionable. Fear Can Change the World? I think so, and indeed it does. Exorcism
- KR : The characters in this film are paralyzed. Trapped in a cabin, are unlikely to intervene in reality and change. Have only a wrench and a few spells to fight a terrifying reality. How did Catholicism in history? In the old horror movies always had crucifixes and garlic. This film seems to have a strong Catholic background.
- LVT: Yeah, but I can not answer because I am a bad Catholic. I'm not anything religious. Every day I'm more atheist.
- KR: But Catholicism is the religion of non-believers favorite for its many expressions, rituals, ornaments, etc., and this, of course, brings us to the toy chest that I mentioned earlier. Catholicism also has a large trunk full of expressions.
- LVT: Yes, they can be fascinating and very attractive, at least for me. Trunk is a much freer. Protestantism has always been the black beast. But religion in general sucks. Yes I can tell.
- KR: The whole system of expression is in Breaking the Waves and Antichrist.
- LVT : The Antichrist, Nietzsche, it is my bedside table since I have 12 years. It is his great battle with Christianity.
- KR: I was surprised previously talked about doing a stage adaptation of The Exorcist, because more Catholic exorcism, impossible. "Exorcise your own demons, demons real? Is not psychoanalysis a form of exorcism?
- LVT: Yes, but these demons are my friends. Perhaps the advantage of making movies: the demons, which can cause much suffering when you meet them, they have another role. To put on film, they become friends, playmates, accomplices. It is possible that "The Scream" did feel good to Edvard Munch. Munch
came to Denmark to treat him a Dr. Jacobsen, who also handled Strindberg. Munch therapy changed for the worse. I think that was more interesting before.
You can go too far, but at least it's interesting. When the madness recedes, the quality of work suffers, they say. Maybe ...
- KR: Is it worth paying that price?
- LVT : Never worth it. Not to sound repetitive, but I have been fatal.
- KR: Let me return to the paranoia. The opposite of being persecuted and is terrified to be on top and control everything. Instead of feeling persecuted by your fears, you put in a dominant position and control the other, why are you so quiet satisfied when wheels?
- LVT : Normally yes, but not so this time. I'm not afraid to make films, to declare my intentions and judge me. However, this time I was afraid to be on set. Riding a big thing like this and be the center implies a certain claustrophobia, and this film was a center considerably poorer than in previous ones. I realized I needed joy. Now, with the mixed film, I feel very happy. It was very nice. But there was no ecstasy.
- KR: Can it be that much more at stake've got a masterpiece? The strength and the breaking of images film are like lightning.
- LVT : There is a difference because I went to a youth with a lot of material substance. There were things that I even tried to delete because I seemed too uncomfortable. But I'm at a stage where I feel very happy.
- KR: Do you have something to do with aging?
- LVT: It has to do.
actors and spectators
- KR: I would like to talk about the actors. How was working with them? Keep in mind you asked a lot.
- LVT: I had worked before Willem, in Manderlay. It is a very nice man. I asked if he had anything for him and I said yes, but my wife said she did not have the courage to do so. I think it stung. But obviously does not mind at all showing off her body and I think it does very well.
talked with a few actresses, but no one dared. Charlotte did not hesitate a moment after reading the script. And that's the best, two actors who are really interested in doing the film. They must be, because I asked a lot. Were amazing. I've never seen anyone work with the intensity of Charlotte. His script was full of notes did not want to teach anyone.
- KR: What do you expect the reaction that may be in Cannes?
- LVT : The Cannes audience is very open. What is prohibited to display? What two people fucking?
- KR: There is a certain modesty about his genitals.
- LVT: I hope my audience will appreciate still being taught such things.
- KR: Do you think the atrocities seen in the film act as a barrier that will not see it?
- LVT: I can not imagine that to happen. I want to go see the movie, of course. The career of a filmmaker is like a series of questions aimed at a group of people. If you accompany me always, "my people." But above all, I want the movie to find an audience.
- KR: That's what I call fetishism, you almost want to worship. You are also a fetish of the image.
- LVT : Aha!
- KR: For example, you used a camera capable of shooting at very low speed. Instead of speeding up the image to increase the voltage going in the opposite direction: the suffering static, static paranoia underlined by footage shot slow-motion, almost look like photographs.
- LVT : Some time ago I thought of shooting only one very long scene with opera music. I opened the old trunk and there was the slow motion. It is relatively simple to make and has a peculiar beauty. At bottom, I like to use old techniques, but in this case, I let him because it is a kind of film "emergency" was my salvation. He must do something or I was in bed, staring at the wall.
Many images are of imaginary journeys I have made. I learned techniques of shamanism and found many of those images in my travels. For example, the sound of a drum can cause a trance, can lead to a parallel world. It is very interesting and a great time. I've never taken acid, but it must be something similar.
- KR: It's funny, we always end up saying the same thing in different ways. Talk movies with pretty pictures passive states static, passive paranoia, fear and voyeurism, all to satisfy a desire sadomasochistic.
- LVT : (Laughs) Yes, the labels are always helpful.
- KR: No, do not mock. A good dose of perverse inclinations is part of any healthy and natural life.
- LVT: Yes, we better hold on to that, if not, we have fatal. My perversions, such as those reflected in the film are not new, just what is the way the show. And as part of the material dates back to my youth, it may be unreasonable, ecstatic. It was necessary to reach the final of the emotions and fears. In a way, is a film more childish than the previous.
- KR: Some might describe it as a child sex research.
- LVT: course, that's it! You hit the nail.
Women
- KR : Once, I asked Nicole Kidman: "Why do you treat women so badly?" We know that Strindberg was a misogynist. I do not hate women, but do not worry you get you accused of misogyny? The evil female sexuality. As the serpent in the Garden of Eden, should be punished. Or just a romantic game?
- LVT: I just saw a documentary about the witch hunt. Say what they want, but it's a hell of history. A great material. I do not believe in witches. I do not think that women and their sexuality are evil, but scary.
free of ties is important when making a movie. Who cares what I think? Some images and concepts are interesting when mixed. Show pieces of the human soul, that's interesting. I also
self-induced. My mother was a staunch advocate of liberation of women. I'm very open to gender equality, but I think it becomes a reality. The sexes are very different, and less evil. I do not think women should be subjugated, and even less with violence. I am totally against it.
The witch hunt was something horrible, but the image of the witch is fascinating stuff. In this film, and let it flow into me instead of thinking myself, what I reflected on the negative tends to be somewhat exaggerated. It is as if hanging a strip of flypaper: thoughts and images are stuck to the film, but to say that I am a misogynist is a mistake
Knud Romer was born in 1960. He worked in The Idiots, Lars von Trier, and co-wrote the screenplay for Offscreen, Christoffer Boe. He studied Comparative Literature at the University of Copenhagen and worked several years in advertising. His autobiographical novel, Den som blinker er Bange for Dodena (The flashes are afraid of death) (2006), was a bestseller in Denmark and sold in twelve countries. Won the French Booksellers Prize, the Prix d'Automne Initiales and Pen Prize for Literature.
Cahiers du Cinéma 
